A an idea for Rage + Hasten in Super Strength

[Noble]

I've been thinking and I'm starting to think that the 10 seconds of being unable to do anything except to yourself once Rage ends is like a failsafe so that people cannot be constantly stacking rage upon rage upon rage. I imagine that once you get over 4 or 5 rages stacked up you'll be in a stage of constant "do nothingness".

I plan on playing with this in future when I can slot up hasten and rage some more, just to see exactly how far I can go and how much damage I can get up to.

Just a thought I wanted to throw out there.

[Xanatos]

I've never really found Hasten to be that useful for a tank. 3 recharge SO's in Rage and it's perma-anyway. Like you said - the mroe rages you stack the less you can do, so dps relatively remains the same.

Still it'll be interesting to see your findings.

[vyxzuw]

Hasten can allow you to use your more powerful attacks more often.

Imagine an Energy tank using Energy Transfer and Total Focus, over and over. They'll do better (damage wise, anyways) than a tank that uses them less often. (They'll use more end though.)

That, and for an Inv tank, you can use it to help recharge Unstoppable and Dull Pain (and also save some slots in Rage.)

[Noble]

can hasten stack on itself?? Probably a moot point but I'd like to know for my research.

All the same though, I most likely will not be able to check this out for a few weeks. Need to hit another level and also wait until school is out.

[Sable Phoenix]

Actually, not true.

Tiger has Hasten perma'ed and Rage six-slotted with recharge reducers. I can stack Rage once, i.e., have two running at a time, with about 15-20 seconds of only one at a time running. Two is your max. This works out to 10 seconds of downtime about every 90 seconds or so.

Which is still ridiculously frustrating...

[Xanatos]

Hasten can allow you to use your more powerful attacks more often.

They're also your more endurance heavy powers. The only way to offset this is to use more endurance enhancements. Which pretty much keeps the dps the same as it woudl be without hasten. Also with increased rage 'stackage' the dps drops even more as the attack downtime is increased.

Hasten might be good for energy meleers, but not for Superstrength tankers :)

[Noble]

I too have had two rages stacked, but I don't have my recharges fast enough to try for more yet. My guess is that maybe if I get it right I might be able to get a ten second window of possibly four rages stacked up before the long cool down time of doing nothing begins. It would have to be timed just right though, which is why I would like to have some super fast recharge times.

In that ten seconds I would be able to do 1,000-1,200+ damage using all of my current attacks. Some good heavy hitting for a tough boss, or even a monster.

I haven't had any time yet to really test this idea though even remotely or to make more accurate calculations. But how long does Rage last? Two minutes, one minute, or 90 seconds? I never payed attention before :P.

[Sable Phoenix]

No, you can only stack Rage once. Two going at one time is the maximum. I think it lasts 120 seconds, same as the old version of Unstoppable.

[vyxzuw]

The only way to offset this is to use more endurance enhancements.

Or use Unstoppable, which gives an end boost.

Not exactly something you can do all the time, but usefull.

[Noble]

No, you can only stack Rage once. Two going at one time is the maximum.
So you already tried this I take it.

[Sword]

I've never really found Hasten to be that useful for a tank. 3 recharge SO's in Rage and it's perma-anyway. Like you said - the mroe rages you stack the less you can do, so dps relatively remains the same.

Still it'll be interesting to see your findings.

Perma-Hasten is TEH GOODNESS for many tanks. Persoanlly, I use Battle Axe, which has really long rechargers. With pemra Hasten, I need Beheader, Swoop, Cleave and Pendulum to actually have a working attack chain without holes. And getting to use Cleave as often as possible is niiiice :D

[Sable Phoenix]

So you already tried this I take it.

Tried and still use. I came up with the perma-Unstoppable, perma-Rage build long before I3, and entirely on my own; never looked at a guide or anything. Stacked Rage makes a noticeable difference, about 40-100 points worth from running a single Rage at level 50, depending on the attack. I have Rage sixed with recharge reduction SOs and perma-Hasten.

[Noble]

So you have tried to stack rage more than twice and has failed Sable?

[Sable Phoenix]

Well... yeah. If I have six recharge SOs and perma-Hasten, I don't see how you can get any faster outside of buffing by other heroes. And even with Speed Boost, I never have gotten more than two Rages running at a time.

[Xanatos]

Perma-Hasten is TEH GOODNESS for many tanks. Persoanlly, I use Battle Axe, which has really long rechargers. With pemra Hasten, I need Beheader, Swoop, Cleave and Pendulum to actually have a working attack chain without holes. And getting to use Cleave as often as possible is niiiice :D

Well that's different innit. ;) You're BATTLEAXE :P

Well... yeah. If I have six recharge SOs and perma-Hasten, I don't see how you can get any faster outside of buffing by other heroes. And even with Speed Boost, I never have gotten more than two Rages running at a time.

Hamidon enhancers :)

[Sable Phoenix]

Well okay. Hami gives recharge reduction? That'd be 50%. Let's work it out then. 6x33=198% reduction (200% for all intents and purposes), while 6x50=300%. If I can stack Rage right now with six SOs and perma-Hasten (250% reduction) and get an approximately 20 second downtime between recharges where I'm running only one Rage, then a 350% reduction may give me a point where I can run three Rages for a few seconds. Remember though, that enhancers give diminishing returns the higher you get. I doubt it would make that much of a difference, really.

[Noble]

I'm not just talking about perma hasten though. I'm talking about stacking hasten, doubling it up. Two hasten buffs running at once. Is it possible?

[Xanatos]

I just checked about Hamidon enhancers - the recharge ones only give 30%.

So meh, they're probably less affective than SO's in this instance.

[Sable Phoenix]

Stacking Hasten is actually not possible. It requires 6 recharges just to make it perma.

[Xanatos]

You can stack hasten:

*Activate Hasten
*Log out
*Relog
*Activate hasten

;)

[Sable Phoenix]

You can? That's quite an interesting, but ultimately useless, bug. Are are you going to tell me that you're going to do that every 120 seconds? Somehow I doubt that. You'd never finish a mission in your life.

[vyxzuw]

Especially since the mission will reset when you log out. :p

I doubt you can double it, but using AM or Siphon Speed could be interesting.
Any Defs/Cons tried that?

[Graphite]

I have PermaRage and PermaHasten and absolutely love it. Now, I also have Granite Armor, so its for quite a different reasoning. Granite Armor has a -25% recharge on all powers and a -25% damage debuff to all attacks. Rage is a 25% buff and so is Hasten so they cancel each other out perfectly. Combined with that I only need one toggle, there are absolutely no endurance problems (with a 6 slotted stanima at least). Now, I'm no where as deadly as your fire tanks and nasty things happen when Rage and Hasten Drops. The 10 sec penalty in Rage can kill a teammate so I don't use it when herding. With Granite, Hasten isn't quite permaed (even 6 sloted so I might be wrong on the percentage) for about 15 seconds so theres a moment when my recharges go to heck.

As for double stacking Rage (having the power go off 3 times), why bother? With damage SOs on high damaging attacks (and we don't have that many) you're gona hit the cap. To my knowledge its not possible anyway.

[Sable Phoenix]

Except the difference in damage between one Rage and two Rages is approximately 10 percent, depending on the power. I tested against -1 bosses at level 50 with five damage SOs in each attack. With one Rage, Haymaker does 283, Knockout Blow does 644. With double Rage, Haymaker does 324 and Knockout Blow does 703. 40 and 60 points of damage increase, respectively. I think that's plenty of difference to warrant running it stacked.