White Smoke Detected

[WingedAvenger]

A new pope is chosen...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v688/alterian/pope.jpg

[suburbanhell]

A new pope is chosen...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v688/alterian/pope.jpg

ROFLMAO!!! :D

[Noble]

A new pope WAS chosen. And the white smoke DOES indicate that the choice was made.

I guess I don't see the humor in that, and I'm not catholic either.

EDIT - never mind. my super slow dial-up led me to believe that there was no picture attatched. Now that I see there is, I too am laughing. :P.

[Tarkenchi]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahah *breathes* AHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH.... :chuckle:

[AfterglowNoMore]

Was the guy really a Hitler youth?

[Black Razor]

Leave it to the Catholic church to elect someone named Ratzinger to office... I mean ..come on ..Rat ..Zinger. I know I have said this before ..but goddess am I glad I am Wiccan. :razor:

[Poison]

Haha, Pope Sidious.
I hate Ratzinger, was hoping he wouldn't be chosen. Not that I care who's pope, but I would have found it cooler if that Nigerian had become it.

[Vendel]

.but goddess am I glad I am Wiccan. :razor:


Nope sorry wrong answer....and what do we have for our contestent....why its eternal damnation Chuck :conscienc

Everyone knows only snake handlers are going to heaven tisk

[Poison]

..but goddess am I glad I am Wiccan. :razor: Wow, I just noticed that. Do you go skyclad, too? :yoy:

[sheld0n]

Was the guy really a Hitler youth?

I think it was obligatory, but that still doesnt justify it wholly.
Yeah, the guy looks scary, i hope he doesnt do anything stupid.

[Esbat]

but goddess am I glad I am Wiccan. :razor:

How you doin'? :naughty:

[MikeKAY]

So essentially what is being said here is that Darth Sidious, Dark Lord of the Sith... is German.

Well damnit, I could have told ya that! :P

[Malibu Sally]

I think it was obligatory, but that still doesnt justify it wholly.
Yeah, the guy looks scary, i hope he doesnt do anything stupid.

Good God! Listen to yourselves. "Wasn't he in the Hitler Youth?"

So WHAT? He was 12 years old and it was MANDATORY! No 12 year old in this planet's history has had any inkling about the long term political ramifications of what they did at that age. If you check further, you see he was dismissed from that organization in his later teens upon discovery that he desired to study for the priesthood.

Look. Here is what the deal is. This guy is a 'trasitional' pope. It's a fairly common occurance in the church to elect, after a long papacy, one who's tenure will not likely be long or boat rocking. He is 77 years old and one of the church's leading conservatives. His reign as pope will likely not last more than 6 to 8 years, and being conservative, he will leave in place the changes that have occured in the church since the Vatican Council of the 60's(oddly, he was considered to be one of the more progressive theologians of the church back then)

No. No great resurgence of the crusades or the inquisition here. Those fears are baseless. If you were expecting a more progressive pontiff, just wait a few years. If past record is any indication, the next pope WILL be more progressive. Since this new pope is 77 years old, the next one is probably not too far off.

[Tarberetta]

/em agree with Sally

Really now...being Mandatory even a 12 year old can figure out that you can either join the youth, or take a bullet (as I'm sure a "no" anwser would get you).

What would you do?

[The Widowed]

Wow, I just noticed that. Do you go skyclad, too? :yoy:
Sometimes. Mostly for Beltane. :D

[sheld0n]

Actually its more of a problem with his parents, i guess. They must have known full and well what the jig was about, and there are always means to skip such laws. Somewhat like people not joining the army today. So the question is, if his folks let him go there and brainwash him, what kind of people were they? And how did they raise him?

Obviously, this doesnt mean he must be some nazi scum, im just not sure if he should be the pope.

You do have a very good point with the transitional thing though.

[MikeKAY]

Actually its more of a problem with his parents, i guess. They must have known full and well what the jig was about, and there are always means to skip such laws. Somewhat like people not joining the army today. So the question is, if his folks let him go there and brainwash him, what kind of people were they? And how did they raise him?

Obviously, this doesnt mean he must be some nazi scum, im just not sure if he should be the pope.

You do have a very good point with the transitional thing though.

First off, we do not have mandatory military service today, no one HAS to join the Military. If you are referring the draft dodgers, there is a significant difference between that and a concentration camp and or death. There was no legal loopholes with the Nazis, you joined or you and your family died. Is that simply enough? Besides, if a draft dodger can become President then a 12 year old from the Youth Army can become Pope.

His parents where doing what most everyone under Hitler was doing, staying alive by playing along. Plus if we are going to associate the crimes of past generations with the reputation of todays people then no Italian is fit for the office either.

As for Ratzinger getting it, Sally nailed it down nicely.

[sheld0n]

Ok, i guess i was probably wrong.

I should have given the guy some time, see how he acts before judging him.

Pretty dumb of me, now that i think about it...

[Malibu Sally]

Also bear in mind that, like any large establishment, change is generally slow paced. Vatican Council II ushered in some extraordiarily rapid and radical changes for an organization as old and large as the Catholic church.(oddly, those changes were initiated by John XXIII, who was supposed to be one of the safe, "trasitional" popes when he was elected)

While JPII was a staunch conservative on many church doctrines, overall he was quite progressive. Another progressive pope could actually bring about instability in the church. Benedict XVI is seen as the "safe" choice. Whether he maintains the status quo or not remains to be seen.

One of the reasons Arinze of Nigeria was not elected has to do with his age. He is 72. A progressive pope should be a younger man with a potential for a papacy of 10+ years. Some of the South American cardinals are younger, but that region is still alive with "Liberation Theology". (http://home.earthlink.net/~ronrhodes/Liberation.html) The church is not ready to give liberation theology a toehold in the Vatican.(read that article... There is some scary stuff in there)

[coldcut]

Definitely agree with Sally here. If you're not Catholic, it's really none of your business, other than to know who the guy is and what he believes.

I would have liked to have seen a Pope who would have made some impact on the AIDS crisis in Africa, but that's been a sort of non-Catholic pipe dream.

As for the Nazi thing:

On the New Pope
by ct
Tue Apr 19th, 2005 at 13:07:08 PDT

Today has seen the third papal election in my lifetime. There are many reasons to criticize the election of Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger as Pope Benedict XVI, like his stances on women and gays in the church, social issues, his work in crushing liberation theology, his comments in regards to the priest sexual abuse scandals, and his generally conservative views.

Calling him a Nazi, however, is unfounded and unfair, and only serves to demean us.

The man is 78 years old. He was 18 when the war ended. He is of the right age group where you were required by law to join the Hilter Youth. Membership in the Hitler Youth by no means made you grow up to be a confirmed Nazi, although that was certainly the intent. Belonging to a Luftwaffe AA battery is also not a sign that he was a Nazi; had he been a fanatical Nazi, not only would he have volunteered for the Waffen SS, but he wouldn't have deserted in 1944. That desertion in itself is not an unremarkable act. They still shot deserters at that time. Being in the German Army does not mean that you were a Nazi.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize this pope and the policies he's likely to enact. Unfounded accusations are unfair, and will only serve to give the wingers more ammunition.

Call him conservative, call him reactionary, call him old, call him surly, call him the wrong choice. Just don't call him a Nazi.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/4/19/1678/13588

There's also that issue of Christian forgiveness, which I hear, still happens on occasion these days.

[inkblaster]

Awesome, discussing religion on the internet is like running the in the Special Olympics....

But anyways, wiccan schmican, do you guys have a big huge chapel with fancy paintings by some freaky italian guy that also sculpted nudes of the male form?(strangely they also don't like women....)

Do you have ceremonies where you lock away the highest leaders of your order in said big fancy shmancy temple, and they light up something to produce white smoke, thus signifying they've chosen the new leader? BAH! I think not!

Do you have the clout to wear priceless hats and gowns that look like something from Liberace's wardrobe?(strangly, they also don't like gays....?)

I think not! Please continue with your serious discussion of this religious topic, as I'm sure you'll reach a very sensible conclusion that everyone will agree to by the end.
O_o

[Magna Harrier]

Well, most of the issues with discussing religion stem from people's tendency to need to tear down Christianity once they've broken from it. There's enough bitter ex-Catholics and ex-Mormons out there that anything religious MUST be bad.
Quite frankly, speaking as a hippy agnostic (albeit one in the military), JPII (as his street name will be listed) was a pretty happenin guy. As several folks have noted, you don't exactly go in changing things at random all at once if you want to make changes in a huge, conservative organization. My one beef with him is that I wish he had come to accept birth control rather evolution. Evolution will happen regardless, but abstenence-only sexual education causes way more problems than it solves.
On the upside, his willingness to mend bridges with other faiths is a huge step foward for the vatican, and it looks like Benevict 16 will continue this trend. Essentially, he's there to keep the pace of slow progression going, probably for about a decade or less, and then we'll get either our next big right wing or left(ish) wing Pope.
And let it be noted that I, too, go skyclad.
I'm not Wiccan or anything. I just can't find shoes in my size, and without the right shoes, there's really no point.

[coldcut]

I think not! Please continue with your serious discussion of this religious topic, as I'm sure you'll reach a very sensible conclusion that everyone will agree to by the end.
O_o

Liberace was Pope?

[Malibu Sally]

Liberace was Pope?
Maybe he meant Elvis.

[AfterglowNoMore]

No, Elvis was God, duh. :P

[Malibu Sally]

No, Elvis was God, duh. :P
What about Rip Taylor?

[AfterglowNoMore]

What about Rip Taylor?Buddha, maybe?

[Black Razor]

Awesome, discussing religion on the internet is like running the in the Special Olympics....

But anyways, wiccan schmican, do you guys have a big huge chapel with fancy paintings by some freaky italian guy that also sculpted nudes of the male form?(strangely they also don't like women....)

Do you have ceremonies where you lock away the highest leaders of your order in said big fancy shmancy temple, and they light up something to produce white smoke, thus signifying they've chosen the new leader? BAH! I think not!

Do you have the clout to wear priceless hats and gowns that look like something from Liberace's wardrobe?(strangly, they also don't like gays....?)

I think not! Please continue with your serious discussion of this religious topic, as I'm sure you'll reach a very sensible conclusion that everyone will agree to by the end.
O_o


No ..we just dance around in moonlight naked ..well ..theres usually body paint ..but thats not so much clothing.

[coldcut]

No ..we just dance around in moonlight naked ..well ..theres usually body paint ..but thats not so much clothing.

See, I keep trying to tell my neighbors that it's a religious ritual, but they just say it's "being drunk and disorderly on the front lawn."

[The Widowed]

No ..we just dance around in moonlight naked ..well ..theres usually body paint ..but thats not so much clothing.
You use body paint?

...

Looks like we'll have to go out and buy some body paint. Or maybe brew up some homemade woad. So we can get a little lightheaded before the ritual ends and the high priest and high priestess start shagging like rabbits in front of us.

And then we run out and fight the King of England. You know...because of the woad paint. Crazy stuff there. :D

[Poison]

Body painting or not.
PICS! :naughty:

[Tarkenchi]

Body painting or not.
PICS! :naughty:
Pfft! Pics are for noobs, VIDEOS!!!! :chuckle: :naughty:

[Poison]

*smacks Tark*
Silence, kid!

[Tarberetta]

men :rolleyes:

[Astartus]

Kitttttyyyyyyy!

[Solario]

Just to make a few corrections here, not joining the Hitler Jugend wasn't punishable by death, but the parents risked major jail time and the children would be secluded from all forms of higher education.

But anyway this is not the reason I don't like "God's Rottweiler" (one of Ratzinger's many nicknames), I don't like him because he has been stated to A. continue the Church's current opinions towards marriage and abortion, B. Called Rock a "An outlet for basic lust," C. The Harry Potter books for "Subtle seduction" (concerning Magic) and D. basically insulted every other religion on the planet, by saying they were insuficient.

Oh yeah and women can still not be priests.

[Malibu Sally]

Just to make a few corrections here, not joining the Hitler Jugend wasn't punishable by death, but the parents risked major jail time and the children would be secluded from all forms of higher education.

But anyway this is not the reason I don't like "God's Rottweiler" (one of Ratzinger's many nicknames), I don't like him because he has been stated to A. continue the Church's current opinions towards marriage and abortion, B. Called Rock a "An outlet for basic lust," C. The Harry Potter books for "Subtle seduction" (concerning Magic) and D. basically insulted every other religion on the planet, by saying they were insuficient.

Oh yeah and women can still not be priests.

Thanks Sol. You gave reasons why you don't like this particular person that are fairly clear cut. I can respect that. Take comfort in this pope's age. He is the oldest to be elected in over three hundred years... He won't be around very long.

Other message boards I frequent are loaded with people who can't get past the hitler youth membership and who use that to insinuate that he MUST be some kind of "closet" nazi because of it. Nice to see some people, at least, who can seperate what a person had to do as a teen from what a grown adult espouses as their beliefs.

[BugBite]

Holy crap, you guys. There's no way to like this Pope once you've seen this picture:

http://webpages.charter.net/micah/ratzinger.jpg

[Tarberetta]

:confused: So?

[Tsarmina]

Holy crap, you guys. There's no way to like this Pope once you've seen this picture:

http://webpages.charter.net/micah/ratzinger.jpg
Old guys are creepy. Weather they are the pope or a bus driver. :|

[coldcut]

Old guys are creepy. Weather they are the pope or a bus driver. :|


"Next stop, 28th and Main, followed by YOUR IMPENDING DOOM!"