Auto Assault

[Black Razor]

So on a NCSoft Kevin Bacon kinda City of Heroes related topic ...has anyone else been following Auto Assault's development ... it looks REALLY good. I am a thinkin I will definatly be playing this one.

[Xielos]

I haven't been keeping up with Auto Assault, but from what I saw a few months ago, it looks very cool. I love the 3 class concept where each race has an awesome special ability unique to them.

[Black Razor]

Yep ..three races with 4 classes each. They are striving HEAVLY for balance and making it so whatever you play and/or drive.. you will be on even ground with everyone else. Plus its being developed by the same team that did CoH. Gaffer and Pann both post to the boards. Currently its the only MMO besides CoH I have any desire to play.

[MikeKAY]

Been following this one for a while now, it has a helluva lot of potential IMO. Reminds me of Earth and Beyond a little.

I'll certainly be checking it out.

[Joe Schmoe]

Really would like to check it out. Maybe it'll get you Matrix junkies off my back if you guys like this ;)

[sheld0n]

I have a bad feeling about this game. The premise is interesting, but its too arcade'y and simplistic. Also, they seem to focus too much on the car, instead of the character behind the wheel. Cant say i played the game, but those are the impressions ive gotten so far. Anyway, we'll wait and see. I hope im wrong...

[Randomus]

I love Mad Max. I loved those games where you played a cop and had car battles. So of course I am following Auto Assault. Even signed up for the Beta a while back.

[Poison]

I've been eagerly awaiting the beta for a while. It looks like nice, short fun.

[Tarberetta]

Also eagerly awaiting the beta also, and on the forums...although I kinda lurk more than anything. I wanna play this becuase of playing a little computer game called "autoduel" way back when I was a little tyke on the family Atari 800XL 'puter :tarby:

If I like it...I'll be playing that and CoH

[Xielos]

Anyone remember Streets of SimCity? If Auto Assualt is anything like that I'll give it a whirl :D

[Jade_Dragon]

Yeah, I definately have been following this. I mean, it's freakin' obvious, really. :D Twisted Metal/Vigilante 8 as an MMORPG. One of those "why didn't I think of that" ideas. Like a superhero MMORPG, or one based on flying around in spaceships. (i.e. Earth and Beyond)

I'm an old Car Wars player from back in my tabletop role playing days. Even though Car Wars wasn't literally an RPG, I played a couple of campaigns that way. And I played Auto Duel, too, on the Apple II in my case. Auto Duel WAS Car Wars, it was licensed by Steve Jackson games, so the cars and weapons were all familiar to me. I even have my names all ready, my character is Richard Blayyde, and his car is the Dust Devil.

I can understand the concern about there not being enough focus on the character, but really, the car is really the "character". Like Earth and Beyond. Vigilante 8: Second Offense, with the upgradable cars, really came pretty close to this, I would even have liked to see an online version of that. Auto Assault should be even better, a REAL role playing game where your character (and his car or cars) grow and develop instead of just being upgraded.

Add to that the gameplay mechanics of vehicle combat, even using RPG rules ("roll" to hit instead of FPS style aiming) and I know that I'll enjoy it. It may not be for the "run around and hack and slash" crowd. Just as CoH tried to incorporate some of the elements of FPSs, Auto Assault will probably try to capture that feeling of looking out a windshield and driving.

[iggy880]

Haven't been following it, but I believe a friend of mine got into the beta. The odd thing is that te game I've been playing outside of CoH is that Face of Mankind, the game you guys (the 2 who actually tried it) thought was bad. I wouldn't just give up on it, then found part of it that interested me, and kept playing [/hijak]

I hope this game gets good, and I may try for the beta if some/more of you decide to try it as well.

[Joe Schmoe]

Yeah, I definately have been following this. I mean, it's freakin' obvious, really. :D Twisted Metal/Vigilante 8 as an MMORPG.

Why I want to try this, Vigilante 8 was one of my top favorite games ever :)

[Emerald Sky]

One of those "why didn't I think of that" ideas. Like a superhero MMORPG, or one based on flying around in spaceships. (i.e. Earth and Beyond)

Funny you should mention that last part...the guys developing this, Netdevil, are the same guys that developed Jumpgate. I was in JG for awhile and it really is a good game, but it's a game that is 100% based on skill....of which I have none. I mean, where you aim is what you'll shoot. If your aim sucks, like mine did, it was tough. It was also very pvp oriented, so it had its own niche crowd.

I'll be trying it out mainly because I know the quality that ND puts out. As a long time subscriber to their game, I feel obligated to at least try it out of loyalty to them.

I'll do the same for whatever other game Cryptic decides to make.

[Black Razor]

I have a bad feeling about this game. The premise is interesting, but its too arcade'y and simplistic. Also, they seem to focus too much on the car, instead of the character behind the wheel. Cant say i played the game, but those are the impressions ive gotten so far. Anyway, we'll wait and see. I hope im wrong...

Uh Sheldon ..your character IS the car. the avatar is just something to run around town in. You cant even leave a town on foot ...so of course they are putting a heavy focus on the vehicle.

[Jade_Dragon]

Funny you should mention that last part...the guys developing this, Netdevil, are the same guys that developed Jumpgate. I was in JG for awhile and it really is a good game, but it's a game that is 100% based on skill....of which I have none. I mean, where you aim is what you'll shoot. If your aim sucks, like mine did, it was tough. It was also very pvp oriented, so it had its own niche crowd.

Well, I'm hoping it's not as skill based as all that. I mean, it's described as having a "to hit" system. Then again, that was some time ago, it could be totally different by now. (Makes note to check and see if I can register for beta)

If it IS skill based, though, I'm not worried. I have been told that I am "ruthless". I was juggling the guy with VW Beetle's minigun on V8:2 at the time... :D

[Lorash]

I'm an old Car Wars player from back in my tabletop role playing days.

Rock on! I played Car Wars, Ogre and Illuminati :rock:

I also played TOON a couple times...but we won't talk about that.... :bhump:

[Malibu Sally]

Rock on! I played Car Wars, Ogre and Illuminati :rock:

I also played TOON a couple times...but we won't talk about that.... :bhump:

Greg still has all his TOON paraphenalia. He made me play with him and his buddies once. All I can say is.. The random item/effect generator rules! :crazy: :look:

[8 Ball]

I'm a Twisted Metal veteran since the PS1 days so of course I'm looking at Auto assault :D, already signed up for the beta...now if our characters can be half as interesting as those from TM:Black I'm sold :D.

BTW, what's "Toon"?

[Malibu Sally]

BTW, what's "Toon"?

You'll be sooorrrrryyyyy!
http://www.pen-paper.net/rpgdb.php?op=showbook&bookid=1226

[Lorash]

BTW, what's "Toon"?

"Toon is the Cartoon Roleplaying Game. Play out the zaniest adventures you can imagine . . . but even if you get blown up with dynamite or squashed under a steamroller, nobody ever dies. Great for parents with children, or for childish adults!"

http://www.sjgames.com/toon/

..and yes, as Sally said: You'll be sorry :p

[sheld0n]

Uh Sheldon ..your character IS the car. the avatar is just something to run around town in. You cant even leave a town on foot ...so of course they are putting a heavy focus on the vehicle.

The way i see it, thats the result of lacking focus on the character, not the cause.

This was one of my bigger problems about EaB, and one of the reasons why im so eager to see how Star Trek Online works out.

[Masked Revenger]

Toon Rocks! So does Car Wars! Man, I loved that game. I used to have a bunch of the Uncle Albert's guides. I have the current Car Wars game, it's pretty good. Anyone play it yet?

On topic, I haven't followed this game at all, but I'll go look into it now. ;)

Chris

[Jade_Dragon]

Toon is one of the more fascinating role playing games. It breaks just about every rule of RPGing. It seems to be totally based on character, to an extent even other RPGs can't match. Levels? Toons don't need levels, toons never change. To hit rolls? Who cares, it's funnier if you fail. Mission goals? Don't need 'em, this is a cartoon, just do whatever wacky thing pops into your head. Plans and strategy? One of the rules is actually to "Act without thinking".

It was also a simple system. It really emphasised the character by de-emphasizing the stats. And since these were cartoon characters, they were already caricatures, so their character traits and Beliefs and Goals could be defined in very simple terms. It was also the first RPG that I had seen that suggested using a "tag", a funny voice or mannerism, or an object that the character always carried around, as an identification.

[Jade_Dragon]

The way i see it, thats the result of lacking focus on the character, not the cause.

This was one of my bigger problems about EaB, and one of the reasons why im so eager to see how Star Trek Online works out.

I actually agree on Star Trek Online. I'm really interested in whether and how a multiplayer environment can be implemented where players cooperate in running a single vehicle.

That's not the same thing, though. Obviously if you've got more than one person operating the same vehicle then the emphasis has to be on the individual "human". But E&B and Auto Assault are based more on the personal vehicle, that is an extension of your character. Human beings naturally identify with vehicles. When you are in an accident, you don't say, "That guy hit my car," or even "that guy's car hit my car." You say "HE hit ME!!!"

The emphasis is on the vehicle, because that's the interface you use to interact with the environment. In Star Trek Online, or something like that, the vehicle IS the environment, so that's taking a step back, but even in that there is likely to be a change in point of view. Take Star Wars Galaxies' Jump to Lightspeed, for instance. When you get in a spaceship and begin piloting it around, you don't see your character behind the controls, and you don't operate the ship my making your character operate the controls. Your point of view changes, and you project your "identity" into the ship.

In the end, character isn't about stats. I wrote a game kind of like Star Trek Online in concept, or at least from what I understand it. The individual crewmen didn't really have any stats at all. They all had ten hit points, constant chances to hit, they never levelled or changed their capabilities. They could do things inherent to their "role", like medical crewmen could heal wounds, but as characters they were largely undefined. Most of the stats were concentrated on the ship and what it could do.

I don't see any way to avoid putting the emphasis on the vehicles, so I'm afraid that's what the individual "player" is going to have to be. Largely undefined, with the player using role playing to give his character individuality instead of stats. Then again, maybe we'll get lucky, and there will be lots of options to customize not just your vehicle, but the appearance of the driver, as well.

[sheld0n]

The emphasis is on the vehicle, because that's the interface you use to interact with the environment. In Star Trek Online, or something like that, the vehicle IS the environment, so that's taking a step back, but even in that there is likely to be a change in point of view. Take Star Wars Galaxies' Jump to Lightspeed, for instance. When you get in a spaceship and begin piloting it around, you don't see your character behind the controls, and you don't operate the ship my making your character operate the controls. Your point of view changes, and you project your "identity" into the ship.


If theres one thing SWGJL did right, this is it. Identifying with your vehicle while using it is just fine. The problem with Auto Assault is that theres nothing else. There is no real game oustide of the car. In Star Wars, you can leave your ship and still be a distinct someone. Even if you focus entirely on being a pilot, you can still visit cantinas, have firefights and explore planets.
In Auto Assault i wouldnt expect much more than walking within the boundries of small villages in order to buy car parts and grab quests.
Its like the difference between Driver 2 and Grand Theft Auto 3.

But like i said, nothing is set in stone yet, and hopefully im wrong. We fill find out soon enough...

[Jade_Dragon]

Yes, but Star Wars Galaxies has a ground based system as well, that importantly enough was around BEFORE the space flight system. The ground based system took priority, and even once space was added, it still was equal in its emphasis with the space system. In a way, it's two different games sharing the same characters. It had to start as a ground based game, however, while I don't think Auto Assault could survive starting out that way.

I'll also add that in many ways your preferences are shared by the games you've played. You point out two examples, Driver 2 and Grand Theft Auto. But Driver 2 is not a role playing game, and GTA would still be just as much role playing if you couldn't get out of the car. The old Autoduel game on the Apple was exactly like what we're talking about, your character, outside of the car, only roamed around and bought supplies and parts in the cities. Yet it was a heck of a lot more like GTA than Driver 2.

In fact, the old Car Wars system is probably a good example to use. You could get out of the car, and there were even pedestrian weapons, even up to rocket launchers. But you didn't get out of the car, because 90% of the time you would end up dead if you did. So the drivers were very simple, they basically had hit points (1, 2 or 3 depending on if you had body armor) and skills (like Driver) and that was it.

It's not that I don't think that it would be a bonus if you could get out of your car, behind the safety of some village walls or something, and interact with the environment, and even engage in personal combat. But I definately think you're going to be disappointed if you expect that to be the emphasis of the game. It's not that there isn't a place for that, but I don't think Auto Assault is going to be that place.

[sheld0n]

Hey, youre the one who brought SWG up. :P

And i dont really follow your elaboration on the Driver and GTA comparison...
GTA3 is not an RPG. O_o

It's not that I don't think that it would be a bonus if you could get out of your car, behind the safety of some village walls or something, and interact with the environment, and even engage in personal combat. But I definately think you're going to be disappointed if you expect that to be the emphasis of the game. It's not that there isn't a place for that, but I don't think Auto Assault is going to be that place.

I dont expect it to be the emphasis of the game. Its supposed to be about cars and let it stay that way. I only wish it gave more options of action than just buying and selling things...

Oh and i know id prolly be disappointed with the game, but currently i dont expect it to be any better than Guild Wars (a game that isnt even worth your time alone, not to even mention money). In two words: excessive simplicity.

But let me repeat, the above are just my speculations, based on the info ive seen so far. I might be completely, utterly wrong and Auto Assault might become an amazing success. Id be glad it that was the case. I just dont expect it to be the case.

[sheld0n]

Honestly, look. You have two cars. How much roleplaying can you expect from them? How can they possibly interact, apart from blowing eachother into pieces and maybe racing? What else can you have there?
How long do you think it will last before it gets repetitive?

[Jade_Dragon]

Honestly, look. You have two cars. How much roleplaying can you expect from them? How can they possibly interact, apart from blowing eachother into pieces and maybe racing? What else can you have there?
How long do you think it will last before it gets repetitive?

That argument works both ways.

You have two people. How can they possibly interact, apart from chopping each other to bits and maybe trading? What else can you have there? How long do you think it will last before it gets repetitive?

[Jade_Dragon]

Hey, youre the one who brought SWG up. :P

And i dont really follow your elaboration on the Driver and GTA comparison...
GTA3 is not an RPG. O_o


<shrugs> You're the one that brought GTA up. I thought you were comparing the role playing aspects of GTA to the lack of them in Driver 2. In all honesty, Auto Assault might not be an RPG either, it could be a, to coin a phrase, "Massively Multiplayer Vehicle Combat Game". It could be nothing but that, and still be successful.

Car Wars wasn't really a role playing game either.

[Akamaz]

true, car wars was more of a "get the mission, complete the mission" type setting, or a campaign could involve roleplaying, but it was an aside to the action... now if you'll excuse me, it's time to update my "Gold Cross" information bwahahahah

[Black Razor]

Now now ..Sheld0n has a right to his opinion. Lets not start an argument over the game. My point in posting this was to see if anyone from the PCityGuru community would be playin .. its always nice to carry friends over from one game to another. :P

[Akamaz]

well, i've signed up, so here's to hoping my comp can handle the load

[Jade_Dragon]

On another subject, I was posting in the thread about the pre-archetype days of CoH, and suddenly remembered the "classes" that I created for Toon. These weren't really "classes" in the sense of altering the stats in any way, but I saw them as a way of simplifying the creation of the character and the selection of the Belief and Goals. (Which was the system in Toon which was used to earn XP - if your character acted according to his Beliefs and Goals, he got a Plot Point)

I created four "types", that seemed to cover all of the possible Beliefs and Goals, and then a fifth as a catch-all. The Beliefs and Goals were the divided among them, although I listed them more as an example. Anyway, I thought I'd post them here, either as ideas for the Toon players who might want to use them, or for the non-players, just a commentary on how Toons act...

Also, I associated each with one of the four stats. As a D&D player, the idea of Prime Requisites was on my mind. But they aren't really related, except to say that those with that as their highest stat would probably be that type. The stats are pretty self explanitory, except for the last.

Troublemaker (Muscle)

The Troublemaker is the type of Toon you usually think about, he is selfish, egotistical, and always out for number one, i.e., himself. He can be a "bad" character, like Yosemite Sam, or just mischievous. Daffy Duck, of course, is the ultimate example, he is forever getting himself in trouble, dragging anyone who happens to be around along with him. Troublemakers often have greed or ego as their motivation, they often want money or power and will do anything to get it. The Troublemaker's opposite is the Good Guy, and is often either opposed by him, or teamed with him.

Good Guy (Smarts)

The Good Guy always tries to do the right thing. He is very kind and polite, and will go out of his way to avoid hurting people. On the other hand, he often sees it as his job to stop Troublemakers, and will take action, mainly to try and prevent damage and destruction. While he may hurt a Troublemaker accidently when trying to stop him, he will only rarely do so intentionally, and then only to wear him down and get him to surrender. The Good Guy can occasionally be oblivious to what is going on around him, and may need to be protected by a more active Toon, like a Trickster or Chaser. Porky Pig is the canonical Good Guy.

Chaser (Zip)

The Chaser is always in pursuit of something. Whether it is a meal, an enemy, romance, a good hunt, a friend or pet, or whatever, his sights are always set on meeting that elusive goal. The Chaser is relentless in his chase, but can often miss things that are right under his nose, placing him in danger or foiling his plans. Troublemakers can be, well, real trouble for a Chaser, but the Chaser's real opposite is the Trickster. Many Chasers, however, chase Toons that have no set goals. Wile E. Coyote and Pepe Le Pew, for instance, defeat themselves instead of being defeated by their target. Elmer Fudd, however, is the foil for perhaps the most famous Trickster of them all.

Trickster (Chutzpah) (This was a stat basically equivalent to Charisma or Wisdom)

If the Troublemaker is brawn, then the Trickster is brain, the power of wit and cunning over raw power. Unlike the Troublemaker, he does not seek out conflict, but should it find him, he handles it with confidence. Bugs Bunny is perhaps the best example of a Trickster, and there is little he can't accomplish, if he sets his mind to it. Although he may not be overly strong or smart, there is no one he can't outthink, outwit, or outtalk. Even Chasers can't keep up with the speed with which he comes up with new plans, and get befuddled and confused as he fasttalks them into doing whatever he wants.

No Set Goal

The last type of Toon simply doesn't fit into any of the other categories. All he wants to do is to be left alone, to run, play, sleep, read books, whatever he wants to do. He does not as much react to the things that happen to him, as to allow his foes (usually Chasers) to defeat themselves. The Road Runner fits this categories, while he occasionally plays the role of the Trickster, usually he just either avoids Wile E. and his traps, or ignores them.

[Jade_Dragon]

Now now ..Sheld0n has a right to his opinion. Lets not start an argument over the game. My point in posting this was to see if anyone from the PCityGuru community would be playin .. its always nice to carry friends over from one game to another. :P

I think I've pretty much covered the subject, really. I DO hope there is some sort of character interaction allowed outside the cars, maybe even with weapons, like in Car Wars. I'm just trying not to expect too much.

[Jade_Dragon]

true, car wars was more of a "get the mission, complete the mission" type setting, or a campaign could involve roleplaying, but it was an aside to the action... now if you'll excuse me, it's time to update my "Gold Cross" information bwahahahah

Car Wars was pretty much what it was, an auto duelling simulation. Like MechWarrior was a mech duelling simulation. You could tack some role playing onto it if you wanted, but at its heart it was about machinery clobbering other machinery.

Heheh, Gold Cross. Car Wars had cloning long before SWG thought of it... :D

[sheld0n]

That argument works both ways.

You have two people. How can they possibly interact, apart from chopping each other to bits and maybe trading? What else can you have there? How long do you think it will last before it gets repetitive?

Not at all. Most importantly, there are emotes, that give alot of potential to interaction by themselves. Just look at Gemini park or the Club in CoH.
Then theres so called "social armor", you know, for exmaple when somebody in CoH makes a party on the beach and everyone comes in swimwear.
Somehow i just cant see that happen in Auto Assault. :P
Not to mention that having parties at all could be problematic/weird.

<shrugs> You're the one that brought GTA up. I thought you were comparing the role playing aspects of GTA to the lack of them in Driver 2. In all honesty, Auto Assault might not be an RPG either, it could be a, to coin a phrase, "Massively Multiplayer Vehicle Combat Game". It could be nothing but that, and still be successful.

Car Wars wasn't really a role playing game either.

Nope, i was trying to show how much freedom can be added to the game by a functional on-foot game element. In Driver you get the distinct feeling that its just a game, while GTA seems more like a whole interactive world. At least thats the way i see it.

You guys obviously have different values than i do on the subject and this wont get us anywhere.
But for me, not being able to do anything meaningful without a car is a significant minus.

Also, did you guys read about the "Highway System"? At first, sounds convinient, but when you think about it, all it does is reduce the ammount of work the devs have to put into the game, while taking away another important part of the mmorpg genre: exploration.
The Highway System cuts away all the "boring" parts of the map, where you would have no enemies to encounter.
That means the whole continent consists of few small squares connected by long lines with a "loading" sign on them. You will get ported from one action scene to another; no roaming, no admiring the view or anything like that. Imagine World of Warcraft, with all the terrain taken out, except for the instanced dungeons. This is another similarity to Guild Wars and a big personnal turn-off for me.

On the other hand, maybe it just sounds similar to what Guild Wars did, and its actually very well set up. Maybe these "danger zones" are much bigger than i think. I suppose ill have to see them for myself to find out.

Thanks for your support, Black Razor. :)

Im just worried that somone will come here, read how wonderful the game is, and get all hyped up, only to be disappointed later on, not knowing about the game's bad sides.

[Jade_Dragon]

Im just worried that somone will come here, read how wonderful the game is, and get all hyped up, only to be disappointed later on, not knowing about the game's bad sides.

No danger of that. You have covered the topic in EXCRUCIATING detail.

I've got nothing further to say.

[sheld0n]

Wow, i really touched a sensitive nevrve there, didnt i?
Sorry if i hurt your feelings, i didnt mean to...

[Masked Revenger]

Well, I've looked over the game, and think it looks great! I've signed up for the beta, so Black Razor, you can add me to your friends list (assuming I get in). :)

So far, the one thing I'm not sure I like is the "no death penality" thing. It could be interesting, but I'm just not sure. I'll have to see it in action.

Chris

[Jade_Dragon]

Wow, i really touched a sensitive nevrve there, didnt i?
Sorry if i hurt your feelings, i didnt mean to...

No, no. I just mean that I have nothing further to say.